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handloading vs commercial

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    Posted: May/24/2019 at 07:10
Best read I've had on the subject:


Having recently reentered the hand loading "gang", after years of NOT, I still don't find it overly efficient timewise and the cost differential is almost a negative.  Factory ammo has improved tremendously and once one lays out all the cost factors involved for hand loading, it is a big question if it is worth it.  I am absolutely certain that I can purchase match grade ammo, for almost any caliber, that performs within 1% to 2% of anything I can load.  In a competition, is that ever going to be the deciding factor between "win or lose"?... Certainly if the meme of "difference between mils and MOA is "negligible"" is true, that 1-2% is not going to be much in the equation... there are way too many other factors involved that "contribute" much more.  

I can purchase Federal Premium Gold Medal Match .338 Lapua Magnum for $4.00/round (sometimes less, sometimes more but it averages out).  Given that I already have all the loading equipment (won't average that into the cost), I can load 100 rounds for $4.05/round (not including shipping cost, taxes and my time).  AND, there is no guarantee I can achieve the 1-2% gain in accuracy... probably, but not guaranteed.  (I DID recently load some Etronx .220 Swift with 55 grain Amax bullets that so far are performing a significant amount better than the factory Etronx ammo.  A big plus.)  Spending some time doing a thorough search on the internet, purchasing very carefully, I may be able to drop the hand loading cost by a few cents per round... still my time invested.  It is true that I have a lot more options open hand loading vs purchasing commercial... I can make adjustments not available commercially.  The investment to make those adjustments, however, is not insignificant.  

I do enjoy the rigor of loading my own ammo (as do a LARGE number of people).  Cost effectiveness really doesn't enter in, anymore.  

I have to caveat this, I suppose.  I KNOW I can load for the .338 Lapua Magnum at an approximate half that cost (or just purchase commercial for half that cost)... but I don't use "burner" ammo in my .338.  

I went through all this trying to justify to myself why I started loading again.  What it all boils down to is I just like doing it.  Now that I have all the "stuff", I'll continue... and explore ways to improve the processes while reducing cost and time.  I'm not unhappy that commercial practices have, overall, improved to the point that hand loading is not absolutely necessary.  I am happy that hand loading gives me a whole range of options not easily (or at all) available commercially.  Either way, it all comes at a price.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote supertool73 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2019 at 07:56
Its the 2nd and 3rd shot that will save you the money. Each reload will save u a bit more for as long as your brass lasts.  Thats one reason i never push limits so i don’t reck my brass. 

I have chronoed a lot of federal gold in .308 and most of the times the spreads are in the 30s and 40s. You start shooting 800+ and that makes a pretty big difference. I can get my handloads into low teens and single digits. so i think there are still some good advantages. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JGRaider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2019 at 08:24
Cost is the least important factor to me when reloading ammo.    Quality control and consistency is much better than any factory ammo produced, even the vaunted Hornady Precision 6.5CM ammo of today.   I've pulled bullets from that ammo and had charge variations  of 1.5grains.   That doesn't happen with  my reloads.   Also, seating depth plays a huge roll in accuracy, and I can control that as well.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote supertool73 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2019 at 09:09
I dare be hornady uses a volume measurement vs an actually weight.  When they likely use automated machines there is not really a good way to load to weight. 

I know with my progressive I can make some dang accurate ammo using volume dumps.  Lee loading books make a pretty good arguments for volume vs weight. 

But that being said, for my precision stuff, I still weight each load with my RCBS chargemaster.   
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Originally posted by JGRaider JGRaider wrote:

Cost is the least important factor to me when reloading ammo.    Quality control and consistency is much better than any factory ammo produced, even the vaunted Hornady Precision 6.5CM ammo of today.   I've pulled bullets from that ammo and had charge variations  of 1.5grains.   That doesn't happen with  my reloads.   Also, seating depth plays a huge roll in accuracy, and I can control that as well.  
If one were hand loading and getting variations of 1.5 grains, probably the wrong "hobby".  I settle for no more than +/- 0.05 per the scale.  For anything I expect best accuracy and precision from, I will always weigh every charge... usually, several times.  As time goes on, my perspectives may change... but right now, I'm just not clear on how much difference there really is.  "A difference that makes no difference is no difference".  If I cannot "adjust" for it...
Loading is a dark art... execute all the "perfect science" you can and then the "art" kicks in.  It is a great skill to have and develop, requires much more depth of understanding than just going to the store and buying a box of ammo, has almost immediate gratification when done right, but can leave questions if things don't turn out as expected.  It is an unforgiving art that relies on exact science.  Mistakes can be catastrophic.  I guess that's what makes it so much fun.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote supertool73 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2019 at 10:40
Originally posted by Kickboxer Kickboxer wrote:

has almost immediate gratification when done right,


Very true on that.  We bought my dad a 6mm creedmoore ruger precision and a hornady reloading setup for Christmas.  When he shot his first handloads and we were able to get 1/2 groups, he was thrilled to death. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kickboxer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2019 at 10:56
Amazing how just minor (seemingly) "tuning" of a charge, seating of a projectile (have a long story on that) can have such a large effect on the downrange result.  Can completely change a perception.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RifleDude Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2019 at 11:10
For me, handloading isn't so much an issue of cost savings as it is me wanting to use specific bullets that I frequently can't get in factory ammo for a given cartridge. The improvement in precision inherent in me being able to tweak my velocity and COAL to tune for my specific rifle is a bonus.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kickboxer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2019 at 11:39
Originally posted by RifleDude RifleDude wrote:

For me, handloading isn't so much an issue of cost savings as it is me wanting to use specific bullets that I frequently can't get in factory ammo for a given cartridge. The improvement in precision inherent in me being able to tweak my velocity and COAL to tune for my specific rifle is a bonus.

I agree.  Cost savings has always been touted as an "incentive" for hand loading... in some cases (get it... some cases)  that can be so.  I guess pistol ammo can be a lot cheaper... not sure 223/5.56 qualifies anymore, 7.63x39... I just don't have a feel for, but the ability to do things the manufacturers don't find profitable enough makes it worthwhile.  Once again, I'm not sure accuracy/precision is a driving factor anymore... but then there is the immediate improvement I saw in the Etronx ammo.  So, case by case, I suppose.  I just wish I remembered more, didn't have so much catching up to do.  Of course, "catching up" just might not be possible.  I'm not sure there are that many hours.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RifleDude Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2019 at 11:52
When I was a kid, the cost savings of reloading was the main driver for my family. My dad owned a service station and tire shop, and he would gather up 5 gal buckets full of old lead tire balance weights and melt them down to make SWC cast pistol bullets for his .357 mag wheel guns. I would sit and help him load for hours on end. It was one of the initial bonding moments I remember between me and my dad. Back then, we really had few choices in factory ammo, and it was never difficult to beat factory ammo precision on the first try with most any handload. Not so today, though I still have little difficulty improving on factory ammo precision...not to the same degree as 2 decades ago, but the improvement is still there. Simply being able to tweak your COAL for the specific chamber alone reaps noticeable precision benefits.

Factory ammo has come a long way though, both in selection and precision.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kickboxer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2019 at 12:11
Good story there...
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Volume vs Weight
 
Powders that do not meter well are near impossible to load by volume consistently. If I could find some means of doing so I would load all my cases by volume. Reason being One of the guys I have "tuned" some competition rifles for loads mostly by volume and generally chooses powders that meter well.
I load with pain staking attention to consistent weight. I very seldom get strings of identical velocity. But he with his volume loads consistently gets strings of identical velocities. That has caused me to seriously consider abandoning some of my favorite go to powders. That combined with the fact that it isn't necessary to push these lighter pills to 31/3300fps to be accurate. Much of my research has proven that 2740 to 2770 is a sweet spot for accuracy with most cals. One of the draw backs to his method (so far) is those powders he uses are temp sensitive. So a comp starting in the morning with temps in the mid upper 60's he has his start dope then by afternoon where it may be up to 85/90 he has to adjust his dope. But with the ballistic aps these days that is not always a defeating factor. I have been to Hornady. They do load by volume but they do also monitor weight. Their weight tolerances are not shared so I couldn't find out what kind of swing they allowed. And speaking of Hornady, Their factory match ammo is the only I have seen that produces strings of identical velocities. And much of their match ammo is loaded with blends. More details they don't share. 
 
Dan, you speak of catching up. With all that has change the last 5 yrs it is probably good to start fresh. Not so many old grooves to abandon.
 
As for cost to reload. I remember back when I started I could get new 270 brass for 25.00 per 100. And pills were fairly low too. Not today! When I made the mistake of tuning a 300wsm for competition and ran low on brass. It couldn't be found unless you bought factor ammo and shot that to get brass or went online looking for once fired. And that at the time was running 3.00 a piece. Now before I consider any caliber I look at cost and availability of brass first.
 


Edited by Sgt. D - May/24/2019 at 12:30
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Originally posted by Sgt. D Sgt. D wrote:

Volume vs Weight
 
Powders that do not meter well are near impossible to load by volume consistently. If I could find some means of doing so I would load all my cases by volume. Reason being One of the guys I have "tuned" some competition rifles for loads mostly by volume and generally chooses powders that meter well.
I load with pain staking attention to consistent weight. I very seldom get strings of identical velocity. But he with his volume loads consistently gets strings of identical velocities. That has caused me to seriously consider abandoning some of my favorite go to powders. That combined with the fact that it isn't necessary to push these lighter pills to 31/3300fps to be accurate. Much of my research has proven that 2740 to 2770 is a sweet spot for accuracy with most cals. One of the draw backs to his method (so far) is those powders he uses are temp sensitive. So a comp starting in the morning with temps in the mid upper 60's he has his start dope then by afternoon where it may be up to 85/90 he has to adjust his dope. But with the ballistic aps these days that is not always a defeating factor. I have been to Hornady. They do load by volume but they do also monitor weight. Their weight tolerances are not shared so I couldn't find out what kind of swing they allowed. And speaking of Hornady, Their factory match ammo is the only I have seen that produces strings of identical velocities. And much of their match ammo is loaded with blends. More details they don't share. 
 
Dan, you speak of catching up. With all that has change the last 5 yrs it is probably good to start fresh. Not so many old grooves to abandon.
 
As for cost to reload. I remember back when I started I could get new 270 brass for 25.00 per 100. And pills were fairly low too. Not today! When I made the mistake of tuning a 300wsm for competition and ran low on brass. It couldn't be found unless you bought factor ammo and shot that to get brass or went online looking for once fired. And that at the time was running 3.00 a piece. Now before I consider any caliber I look at cost and availability of brass first.
 

I am discovering all those things... thank you for the info.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Longhunter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2019 at 17:30
I reload rifle, pistol and shotgun for several reasons.
The most important is that I can always load up exactly what I want or need, given one day's notice.

Local stores almost never have exactly what you want.
If you go to the internet, it may be out of stock... or you may have problems with shipping time and costs.

Secondly, I can experiment more easily with different loads, bullets and powders.
This let me find Trail Boss, which is much safer to load for handguns than Bullseye. 
Unlike Bullseye, you can't double charge and blow up  a gun with Trail Boss.
I like this extra margin of safety.

I've been able to find out what bullets (and powders) my rifles like best by experimenting.
Yes, I got better accuracy as a result. 
I'm looking forward to trying some of the new powders designed to prevent copper fouling.

For shotguns, we've found that soft #6 shot is about perfect for a mixed upland bird hunt.
We eat the birds we shoot, and don't like to bite down on hard shot.
Unfortunately, factory loads aren't nearly as good as our handloads made with this shot.

Finally, I strongly recommend "Handloader" and "Rifle" magazines for anyone who reloads.
I subscribe to (or buy) most shooting magazines, and consider these two of the very best on the subject. 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kickboxer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2019 at 17:41
Thank you.  Good info and I appreciate your comments and suggestions.  I've not started on pistol loads, yet, but do intend to.  I know I can make up some savings there.  
Yes, being able to experiment is a true advantage… I'm just getting back up to speed.  I have 17 calibers that I want to work up "exceptional" loads for… today.  I'm a bit behind.  
Any help is appreciated.
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Originally posted by Kickboxer Kickboxer wrote:

Originally posted by JGRaider JGRaider wrote:

Cost is the least important factor to me when reloading ammo.    Quality control and consistency is much better than any factory ammo produced, even the vaunted Hornady Precision 6.5CM ammo of today.   I've pulled bullets from that ammo and had charge variations  of 1.5grains.   That doesn't happen with  my reloads.   Also, seating depth plays a huge roll in accuracy, and I can control that as well.  
If one were hand loading and getting variations of 1.5 grains, probably the wrong "hobby".  I settle for no more than +/- 0.05 per the scale.  For anything I expect best accuracy and precision from, I will always weigh every charge... usually, several times.  As time goes on, my perspectives may change... but right now, I'm just not clear on how much difference there really is.  "A difference that makes no difference is no difference".  If I cannot "adjust" for it...
Loading is a dark art... execute all the "perfect science" you can and then the "art" kicks in.  It is a great skill to have and develop, requires much more depth of understanding than just going to the store and buying a box of ammo, has almost immediate gratification when done right, but can leave questions if things don't turn out as expected.  It is an unforgiving art that relies on exact science.  Mistakes can be catastrophic.  I guess that's what makes it so much fun.

You need  to re-read  what  I posted there KB.  I said I have pulled bullets from Hornady Precisiion ammo and gotten 1.5g variations  in powder charges, not my loads.   I. like supertool, weigh every single  charge of my reloads via the Chargemaster.   Nice try though.   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kickboxer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2019 at 18:42
Originally posted by JGRaider JGRaider wrote:

Originally posted by Kickboxer Kickboxer wrote:

Originally posted by JGRaider JGRaider wrote:

Cost is the least important factor to me when reloading ammo.    Quality control and consistency is much better than any factory ammo produced, even the vaunted Hornady Precision 6.5CM ammo of today.   I've pulled bullets from that ammo and had charge variations  of 1.5grains.   That doesn't happen with  my reloads.   Also, seating depth plays a huge roll in accuracy, and I can control that as well.  
If one were hand loading and getting variations of 1.5 grains, probably the wrong "hobby".  I settle for no more than +/- 0.05 per the scale.  For anything I expect best accuracy and precision from, I will always weigh every charge... usually, several times.  As time goes on, my perspectives may change... but right now, I'm just not clear on how much difference there really is.  "A difference that makes no difference is no difference".  If I cannot "adjust" for it...
Loading is a dark art... execute all the "perfect science" you can and then the "art" kicks in.  It is a great skill to have and develop, requires much more depth of understanding than just going to the store and buying a box of ammo, has almost immediate gratification when done right, but can leave questions if things don't turn out as expected.  It is an unforgiving art that relies on exact science.  Mistakes can be catastrophic.  I guess that's what makes it so much fun.

You need  to re-read  what  I posted there KB.  I said I have pulled bullets from Hornady Precisiion ammo and gotten 1.5g variations  in powder charges, not my loads.   I. like supertool, weigh every single  charge of my reloads via the Chargemaster.   Nice try though.   
Do you INTENTIONALLY misunderstand or just try to create conflict???  I fully understood that it was not you, was not saying that you were getting that wild a variation in your loads... just saying that if anyone was getting that wide a variation in their hand loads they should probably try something else.  I've not pulled apart any commercial loads in a long time.  If you are seeing that much variation, you should definitely call them out on it and they should definitely take a close look at their QC.  That is a potentially dangerous variation.  
What "try" do you think you are calling me on?  
I weigh and re-weigh probably at least 3 times on every charge I load.  
You are on the wrong page here... your paranoia is showing.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kickboxer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2019 at 19:46
Originally posted by Kickboxer Kickboxer wrote:

Originally posted by JGRaider JGRaider wrote:

Originally posted by Kickboxer Kickboxer wrote:

Originally posted by JGRaider JGRaider wrote:

Cost is the least important factor to me when reloading ammo.    Quality control and consistency is much better than any factory ammo produced, even the vaunted Hornady Precision 6.5CM ammo of today.   I've pulled bullets from that ammo and had charge variations  of 1.5grains.   That doesn't happen with  my reloads.   Also, seating depth plays a huge roll in accuracy, and I can control that as well.  
If one were hand loading and getting variations of 1.5 grains, probably the wrong "hobby".  I settle for no more than +/- 0.05 per the scale.  For anything I expect best accuracy and precision from, I will always weigh every charge... usually, several times.  As time goes on, my perspectives may change... but right now, I'm just not clear on how much difference there really is.  "A difference that makes no difference is no difference".  If I cannot "adjust" for it...
Loading is a dark art... execute all the "perfect science" you can and then the "art" kicks in.  It is a great skill to have and develop, requires much more depth of understanding than just going to the store and buying a box of ammo, has almost immediate gratification when done right, but can leave questions if things don't turn out as expected.  It is an unforgiving art that relies on exact science.  Mistakes can be catastrophic.  I guess that's what makes it so much fun.
An English lesson>>>  

One is a pronoun in the English language. It is a gender-neutralindefinite pronoun, meaning roughly "a person". For purposes of verb agreement it is a third-person singular pronoun, although it is sometimes used with first- or second-person reference. It is sometimes called an impersonal pronoun. It is more or less equivalent to the Scots 'a body', the French pronoun on, the German/Scandinavian man, and the Spanish uno


 

You need  to re-read  what  I posted there KB.  I said I have pulled bullets from Hornady Precisiion ammo and gotten 1.5g variations  in powder charges, not my loads.   I. like supertool, weigh every single  charge of my reloads via the Chargemaster.   Nice try though.   
Do you INTENTIONALLY misunderstand or just try to create conflict???  I fully understood that it was not you, was not saying that you were getting that wild a variation in your loads... just saying that if anyone was getting that wide a variation in their hand loads they should probably try something else.  I've not pulled apart any commercial loads in a long time.  If you are seeing that much variation, you should definitely call them out on it and they should definitely take a close look at their QC.  That is a potentially dangerous variation.  
What "try" do you think you are calling me on?  
I weigh and re-weigh probably at least 3 times on every charge I load.  
You are on the wrong page here... your paranoia is showing.

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Sit down before I hose ya both down................. Loading by volume "can" result in that much swing in weight. Though that is about the limit. I've seen several instances where as much as 3-4 grains difference in weight had little or no effect on velocity. There is a vast chasm of opportunity in understanding loading by volume. Such as, when loading a powder (ie. 4350) that doesn't meter well. Does cutting or crushing pellets in a speed loader effect velocity. The only way I know to find out is to load and see. Burn rate and velocity are the two critical considerations in loading for accuracy.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kickboxer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2019 at 20:30
wrong thread, dude...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tejas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/25/2019 at 16:47
Originally posted by Kickboxer Kickboxer wrote:

Best read I've had on the subject:


Having recently reentered the hand loading "gang", after years of NOT, I still don't find it overly efficient timewise and the cost differential is almost a negative.  Factory ammo has improved tremendously and once one lays out all the cost factors involved for hand loading, it is a big question if it is worth it.  I am absolutely certain that I can purchase match grade ammo, for almost any caliber, that performs within 1% to 2% of anything I can load.  In a competition, is that ever going to be the deciding factor between "win or lose"?... Certainly if the meme of "difference between mils and MOA is "negligible"" is true, that 1-2% is not going to be much in the equation... there are way too many other factors involved that "contribute" much more.  

I can purchase Federal Premium Gold Medal Match .338 Lapua Magnum for $4.00/round (sometimes less, sometimes more but it averages out).  Given that I already have all the loading equipment (won't average that into the cost), I can load 100 rounds for $4.05/round (not including shipping cost, taxes and my time).  AND, there is no guarantee I can achieve the 1-2% gain in accuracy... probably, but not guaranteed.  (I DID recently load some Etronx .220 Swift with 55 grain Amax bullets that so far are performing a significant amount better than the factory Etronx ammo.  A big plus.)  Spending some time doing a thorough search on the internet, purchasing very carefully, I may be able to drop the hand loading cost by a few cents per round... still my time invested.  It is true that I have a lot more options open hand loading vs purchasing commercial... I can make adjustments not available commercially.  The investment to make those adjustments, however, is not insignificant.  

I do enjoy the rigor of loading my own ammo (as do a LARGE number of people).  Cost effectiveness really doesn't enter in, anymore.  

I have to caveat this, I suppose.  I KNOW I can load for the .338 Lapua Magnum at an approximate half that cost (or just purchase commercial for half that cost)... but I don't use "burner" ammo in my .338.  

I went through all this trying to justify to myself why I started loading again.  What it all boils down to is I just like doing it.  Now that I have all the "stuff", I'll continue... and explore ways to improve the processes while reducing cost and time.  I'm not unhappy that commercial practices have, overall, improved to the point that hand loading is not absolutely necessary.  I am happy that hand loading gives me a whole range of options not easily (or at all) available commercially.  Either way, it all comes at a price.


Haven’t posted anything a while, still read the threads though. I don’t “plink” either, with .338 or otherwise. If I’m not trying to hit a specific target, I’m trying to get a perfect shot at a biological. I reload because once I’ve established the most accurate reload data I can get for a given firearm, there is no way a factory load can compete. I’m surprised that the factory load your referring to is even close to your handloads. I don’t have a .338 LM either though. Frequently, factory stuff does achieve higher velocity than my loads because they have access to proprietary powder, but I don’t really care as long as mine is accurate and powerful enough to do what I want it to. That accuracy does come at a cost, in time and in cash. Lapua brass and Berger or Barnes bullets for example, are expensive. I also “match grade” every brass case. That includes trimming them all to the same length, uniforming the primer pockets and deburring the flash holes. I weigh every powder charge, but I use a Redding beam scale, not digital. I also measure the overall length of each round.The bottom line is, I don’t save much by reloading rifle ammo. If you count the time I spend, it’s not even close. I don’t neck turn and I don’t weigh brass or bullets. Pistol bullets is whole other ballgame. I only own .45 ACP and that’s all I reload. I do save money by reloading those and I don’t get carried away. I weigh every fifth powder charge. I don’t trim the brass or do anything except the minimum. Obviously, I have lots of free time.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kickboxer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/25/2019 at 20:16
Good comments, tejas.  Thank you.  The point, I think, is that the variety of hand loading outweighs the convenience of commercial and certainly I can create loads that the commercial market just doesn't.  
 
I fully agree with your objective.

I've still got to get my bench set up and get everything off my dining table... as it is, I pretty much have to move and reset for every load session.  Doesn't help the learning/re-learning processes.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JGRaider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/26/2019 at 09:28
Originally posted by Kickboxer Kickboxer wrote:

Good comments, tejas.  Thank you.  The point, I think, is that the variety of hand loading outweighs the convenience of commercial and certainly I can create loads that the commercial market just doesn't.  
 

Quite obviously,  and much more accurately as well.   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tejas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/26/2019 at 09:30
One other thing: You might take a look at Peterson brass. I haven’t tried any yet but I’m going to. Most people think it’s as good or better than Lapua. It’s also less expensive and made in the U.S.
 Graf’s handles it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kickboxer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/26/2019 at 10:01
Originally posted by tejas tejas wrote:

One other thing: You might take a look at Peterson brass. I haven’t tried any yet but I’m going to. Most people think it’s as good or better than Lapua. It’s also less expensive and made in the U.S.
 Graf’s handles it.
I appreciate the head's up.
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