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Thoughts?

Printed From: OpticsTalk by SWFA, Inc.
Category: Firearms, Bows, and Ammunition
Forum Name: Reloading & Ballistics
Forum Description: Anything to do with ammunition
URL: http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=45610
Printed Date: July/03/2020 at 22:21
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.01 - http://www.webwizforums.com


Topic: Thoughts?
Posted By: Sparky
Subject: Thoughts?
Date Posted: April/14/2019 at 20:00
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T6kUvi72s0Y - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T6kUvi72s0Y



Replies:
Posted By: supertool73
Date Posted: April/15/2019 at 00:09
Great video. that 2200 fps number really points out that handguns are just handguns.  

I got accuracy, reliablity, and bullet performance are what matters. 


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Lifetime warranty and excellent customer service don't mean a thing when your gun fails during a zombie attack.

"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything they don't own."


Posted By: RifleDude
Date Posted: April/15/2019 at 06:23
The available data on actual engagements with the various pistol calibers bears this out. Pistol caliber (provided we’re talking about the common self defense cartridges) doesn’t matter. There is no statistical difference in real world effectiveness between them. It’s bullet design and the ability to place those bullets in the right spot that matters. 

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Ted


Money can't buy happiness... but it's much more comfortable to cry in a Porsche than on a bicycle.


Posted By: budperm
Date Posted: April/15/2019 at 06:52
Interesting to say the least! Real info without all the marketing hype!!!!  Thunbs Up

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"Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading".
--Thomas Jefferson





Posted By: Rancid Coolaid
Date Posted: April/15/2019 at 08:59
I agree, assuming the bullet meets certain minimum performance characteristics.

There is a reason most people don't carry 22LR or 380ACP, so there are definitely boundary conditions.

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Freedom is something you take.
Respect is something you earn.
Equality is something you whine about not being given.


Posted By: supertool73
Date Posted: April/15/2019 at 10:05
You can really see this evidenced during hunting.  I have shot a yote with both a 9mm and a .45 auto.  Both just punched little holes, same with Badgers.  I have shot yotes with 223, 243, 6.5 creed, 308, 300 savage and they leave huge wound channels and massive softball and bigger sized exit wounds.  


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Lifetime warranty and excellent customer service don't mean a thing when your gun fails during a zombie attack.

"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything they don't own."


Posted By: 8shots
Date Posted: April/16/2019 at 01:48
I can only add "But being that this is a .44 Magnum, the most powerful handgun in the world, and would blow your head clean off, you've got to ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel lucky?' Well do ya, "


Posted By: Rancid Coolaid
Date Posted: April/16/2019 at 08:45
I am not a physicist, and I don't design bullets. I have noted many times that, for handguns, there are 2 schools: large bullet moving slower, and small bullet moving faster. As this is a discussion of handgun performance, with a clear understanding that neither will get to the number where the real damage happens; I have always sided with the "big bullet moving slower" crowd, for one simple reason. Kinetic energy (1/2m(v*v)) is comprised of mass and velocity, and since you square the velocity, small changes in V quickly make big changes in KE. Bigger bullets slow down faster (if designed for that) thus leading to a lesser risk of overpenetration - meaning some of that KE exiting the target and moving on to a world of other unintended targets.
I was a 45 guy for many years, and still lean that way when I really want and need to start and finish something quickly.
But, as said at the end, it is more about confidence than about absolute supremacy in performance of a caliber.

But none of that applies to my 454 Casull, with a 2.5 inch barrel, that thing could scare you to death even if the bullet missed entirely. All rules stop applying at the 454.

Or something.


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Freedom is something you take.
Respect is something you earn.
Equality is something you whine about not being given.


Posted By: budperm
Date Posted: April/16/2019 at 08:51
Ummmm, Jeff your starting to sound like Dan..... Smile

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"Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading".
--Thomas Jefferson





Posted By: Rancid Coolaid
Date Posted: April/16/2019 at 09:25
Scary, right?

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Freedom is something you take.
Respect is something you earn.
Equality is something you whine about not being given.


Posted By: Sparky
Date Posted: April/16/2019 at 09:42
Originally posted by Rancid Coolaid Rancid Coolaid wrote:



But none of that applies to my 454 Casull, with a 2.5 inch barrel, that thing could scare you to death even if the bullet missed entirely. All rules stop applying at the 454.



Or my S&W PC 500. The muzzle flash is bigger than a basketball. And it even gets the attention of two deaf guys shooting 5 and 6 lanes away at the outdoor range.Big Grin

Winchester 500 SW MAG 400 Grain Platinum Tip Hollow Point.

Velocity rated at 1675 FPS

Energy Rate at 2491 Foot Pounds

Even my indoor range ammo is rated at 1350ft-lbs.



Posted By: Rancid Coolaid
Date Posted: April/16/2019 at 11:00
The first time I shot at an indoor range, I was shooting with a friend. I told him not to watch me, but watch everyone else. This was a 8 or 10-lane indoor range, all steel and concrete.

I lit off one round and everyone in the room either looked around the wall or stepped back off the line to see what just happened.

I bought it for backpacking in bear country. After shooting it a few times, I now wonder if getting bitten by a bear might be preferable to the PTSD that damned thing induces. Chicks dig scars, right?

Now back to the conversation at hand...

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Freedom is something you take.
Respect is something you earn.
Equality is something you whine about not being given.


Posted By: budperm
Date Posted: April/16/2019 at 13:01
Not if the scare has your wife's initials...  Shocked

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"Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading".
--Thomas Jefferson





Posted By: Kickboxer
Date Posted: April/17/2019 at 18:41



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Opinion,untempered by fact,is ignorance.

There are some who do not fear death... for they are more afraid of not really living


Posted By: Tip69
Date Posted: April/17/2019 at 21:38
this is really interesting in the sense of the Bear comment...  I really thought I needed to carry a 44 Mag....  maybe shooting my .357 more accurately would be better.

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take em!


Posted By: Sparky
Date Posted: April/17/2019 at 21:54
If you are open to a new handgun, I would look at a S&W 500. I find I shoot it more accurately than either my 44 or my 357. It is also easier on me as well.


Posted By: mike650
Date Posted: April/17/2019 at 22:01
Nothing wrong with a .357 mag... Bandito

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Fish to Live, Live to Hunt


Posted By: budperm
Date Posted: April/18/2019 at 06:11
Come on Mikey!!!  your Amercian dude, the correct answer is 'bigger is better'!!! Roll Eyes

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"Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading".
--Thomas Jefferson





Posted By: BeltFed
Date Posted: April/18/2019 at 11:06
Dang, this argument has been going on as long as I can remember, and no one has been right.
Shot placement, shot placement, shot placement. Everything else is a gamble.


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Life's concerns should be about the 120lb pack your trying to get to the top of the mountain, and not the rock in your boot.


Posted By: budperm
Date Posted: April/18/2019 at 11:19
Shot placement...yeah, but it helps if your "shot" overlaps multiple critical organs simultaneously..... Hippie

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"Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading".
--Thomas Jefferson





Posted By: budperm
Date Posted: April/18/2019 at 11:20
Stiring The Pot

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"Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading".
--Thomas Jefferson





Posted By: budperm
Date Posted: April/18/2019 at 11:21
Did ya see where Scientist revived a 4 hour dead pig brain?

Another Democrap in the making???  Loco


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"Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading".
--Thomas Jefferson





Posted By: Urimaginaryfrnd
Date Posted: April/20/2019 at 15:14
45-70 Encore pistol seems to do the job adequately, although I have considered having a barrel for it in .375H&H.
http://www.opticstalk.com/uploads/1566/Bullberry.JPG


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"Always do the right thing, just because it is the right thing to do".
Bobby Paul Doherty
Texas Ranger


Posted By: Longhunter
Date Posted: April/21/2019 at 03:13
I put carry guns into two categories:

1.  POCKET GUNS.  Must be flat, light, a natural pointer, and with you all the time.  A good trigger and good sights will make it just right.

2.  BELT GUNS.  These are too big or heavy to carry in your pocket.  My personal test is that it should be able to take down a deer, black bear, boar, or a man the size of an NFL football player..  These generally range in weight from 125 to 320 pounds.  The deer, bear and boar don't offer "psychological stops".  You have to break them down or score an immediately effective hit.  The same is true of a strapping big guy high on drugs.

My oldest son is a boarded ER doctor.  He is not particularly impressed by the damage done by .380 or 9mm rounds.  Dr. Will Dabbs, who writes for gun magazines, has expressed similar opinions based on his ER experiences.

However, if bad stuff happens we each will have to do the very best we can with what we've got.
 



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