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Rabbit hole - NXS, Toric, Leupy or Swaro?

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CrazyEddie View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CrazyEddie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/18/2019 at 09:53
Thank you cbm, Rancid and supercool for these additional insights.  I had looked at the Z6, but it seemed the comparable scopes were more than another $1k above the highest in the group (although I did see there are 3 Z6’s and 1 Z6i on the SL - thanks!).  Otherwise, I think that the Z5 is the only one in the group that isn’t illuminated, and several of the other posts were strongly in favor of illumination at this price point.  Rancid, I’m very interested in your Leupold failures - send me a PM if you are more comfortable sharing the details offline.< ="text/"> p.p1 {margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px 'Helvetica Neue'}
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote supertool73 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/18/2019 at 10:36
 Rancid makes his displeasure for Leupold very well known.  (which is fine, as we all have our like adn dislikes) But he has not used them in years so he has no experience with their current offerings.  So no disrespect intended Rancid.  But take his dislike of them with a grain of salt as it is not current with the scopes they have now.  I have hundreds and hundreds of rounds down range with my 5 and 6 and they are great scope.  Some ways I like them better than a Swaro others not as much. 

The comment they are not any where near optically.  They are.   The difference will be a few minutes in low light.  Maybe.   But if low light is everything, then those few minutes do indeed make a difference and it may be worth while spending the extra money.  For me, they get me well past legal shooting times so I am content.  Plus I can get two or 3 VX5s for the price of some Swaro's.  Just a preference thing. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Rancid Coolaid Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/18/2019 at 11:47
 So, some stuff that might help and might be completely superfluous:

1.  ST is partially right, my feelings for Leupold are well established and have been discussed here and elsewhere.
2.  Though I do not often use their riflescopes, several fellow hunters do.  In the hunting season that just ended,  there were 2 failures, both were Leupold.  Having broken Leupolds in the past, I am probably more aware of their failures in my area, as the guys I hunt with know I am not a Loopy fan and offer anecdotes when they can.
2B. One failure was of the older scalloped-bottom hunter, not sure what model, and it stopped holding zero, as in range shots from a stable base were everywhere, with no turning of dials.  The other is one of the newest, on a beautiful custom 300WM, the elevation turret sheered off under far less force than I would have expected.
3.  I do not purchase Leupold, but I am sometimes forced to use them.  My experiences with Leupold that were crash-n-burn are indeed mostly ancient history, but I have seen failures with their scopes.  And I am sure I am sensitive to that reinforcing information.  That said, the guys that hunt Leupold scopes have been using them for years, this was just a weird year, and timely to this conversation.

So, all that considered, you should indeed take my Leupold input in the context of someone who like Ford and dislikes Chevy but drives a Toyota.
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supertool73 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote supertool73 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/18/2019 at 14:04
I should not have use the wordage Rancid has no experience.  As I have no idea what he has seen his buddies use and that he had played with some.  I should have stated he does not use/own them himself so he will not have the usage experience as some of us that own/use them often. 

My bad Rancid, I typed that in a hurry on my phone, and I really meant no offense on that.  Overall I agree the Swaro is a better scope mostly, especially if low light is critical.  But the VX5 and 6 are dandy's for the money.  Especially the VX5 IMO.  I still own a Z3 and i like it a lot. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote mike650 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/18/2019 at 14:06
Leupold's come a long ways since the days of the overpriced Var-x III's, etc. I'm impressed with the VX5 and 6 lines.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Rancid Coolaid Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/18/2019 at 15:02
 No offense was taken, but I wanted to be sure my comments were not taken within a context of "he has no idea what he is talking about", as I do, just not as much experience as many here.

My lack of experience in that regard is a choice, and is based on an abundance of bad experience back in the day.

I don't buy Jaguars because they used to be very unreliable, maybe they are rock solid now; but it is an old concept that betraying one's confidence leads to a lack of confidence.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Kickboxer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/18/2019 at 15:27
I still have reservations with Leupold scopes, though I do believe they have made progress in recent years... depending less on older technology and design methodologies.  I still don't "depend" on a Leupold, but do own a couple.  I have a "hog scope" mounted right now, have spent a little time shooting with 4, 5, and 6 models.  They seem OK, but I'm still not completely convinced.  
I'm in RC's corner on Leupolds.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/18/2019 at 15:32
From that list the Nightforce would be my pick but I tend more toward tactical scopes.  But this doesnt look bad:

Swarovski 3.5-18x50 X5i 30mm Riflescope

Matte, Illuminated 4WX, 1/4 MOA, Side Focus

SWA79112
708026791123
Swarovski

Only 1 left

Regularly $2,799.00

$2,399.95


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CrazyEddie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/18/2019 at 16:35
Thanks for the additional feedback on the Leupold option.  Urimaginaryfrnd - the x5i does look good, but if I look at another $1k to the range, I've probably got to consider some other options.  Although it seems to me that I'm a masochist on this effort, at some point I will need/want to pull the trigger.  Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote cbm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/18/2019 at 16:55
After all of my experimenting , I personally feel like Schmidt and Bender makes the best scopes. The glass is as good as it gets. But the overall quality , smoothness of the power ring, positive click adjustments, etc, is the best IMO! I still have some Swarovski’s that I like a lot, but I think SB is the best. Their low light performance is awesome and the illuminated are super nice.

I just got a great deal on a 3-12x42 mil dot and put it on my Kimber 280 Ackley. I used to have a Cooper Excalibur 30-06, they are definitely shooters!! I hit some steel plates at 800 yrds with it. That’s the farthest I have ever shot.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CrazyEddie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/18/2019 at 18:08
Originally posted by cbm cbm wrote:

After all of my experimenting , I personally feel like Schmidt and Bender makes the best scopes. The glass is as good as it gets. But the overall quality , smoothness of the power ring, positive click adjustments, etc, is the best IMO! I still have some Swarovski’s that I like a lot, but I think SB is the best. Their low light performance is awesome and the illuminated are super nice.

I just got a great deal on a 3-12x42 mil dot and put it on my Kimber 280 Ackley. I used to have a Cooper Excalibur 30-06, they are definitely shooters!! I hit some steel plates at 800 yrds with it. That’s the farthest I have ever shot.

Thanks cbm.  I looked through the S&B site and then did some price checks and I *think* that the comparable models are all materially more expensive, even on the SL - but I may have missed something (the naming conventions for the models is not straight forward - to me at least).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote mike650 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/18/2019 at 18:15
S&B is very pricey and considered on the heavy side to me but I spot and stalk hunt.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote cbm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/18/2019 at 18:38
They are a little heavy. But the 3-12x42 is 19 oz so not too bad, to me. And they are really good in low light for a 42mm.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote mike650 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/18/2019 at 18:42
I bet... and that’s the power range I would consider (with illumination) if I bought one.    
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/19/2019 at 19:53
consider exit eye pupil size  objective divided by the power setting = exit eye pupil size in mm.
  • Leupold VX-5HD 3-15x56 -   bright at 8x and below in low light
  • Swaro Z5 3.5-18x44 -           bright at 6x and below in low light
  • Toric 4-20x50 -                      bright at 7x and below in low light
  • NF NXS 3.5-15x50 -               bright at 7x and below in low light   ....Thumbs Up

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