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Scope 22LR or 17HMR?

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PappaBear View Drop Down
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    Posted: April/14/2008 at 14:34

I have been thinking about buying a nice 22LR or a 17HMR.  I want to get a bolt action and use it for plinking, practice and some squirrel fun.  What is the classic best power range for 22's.  ie 3-9X40 or 4 power fixed.  I have mostly Conquest scopes, but really like the Nikon's for the money.  Any suggestions are apprecaited. 

 

I am thinking about that Sako Quad or the New Weatherby.  Anyone have a 22LR they love.  I already got the Ubiquitous

10-22 Ruger.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 3_tens Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/14/2008 at 14:55
Get you a 17 HMR you will love it. They shoot like a laser. You will probably want to up the power a little over the 3-9 .I have 2 17s and they both are sub 1/2 moa off of bags. Nikon 4-12x40 Monarch UCC Riflescope on a marlin or savage would be nice.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cheaptrick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/14/2008 at 14:59
Originally posted by PappaBear PappaBear wrote:

I have been thinking about buying a nice 22LR or a 17HMR.  I want to get a bolt action and use it for plinking, practice and some squirrel fun.  What is the classic best power range for 22's.  ie 3-9X40 or 4 power fixed.  I have mostly Conquest scopes, but really like the Nikon's for the money.  Any suggestions are apprecaited. 

 

I am thinking about that Sako Quad or the New Weatherby.  Anyone have a 22LR they love.  I already got the Ubiquitous

10-22 Ruger.

 
I have been using a Nikon 4x Prostaff for my .22 recently. Works well for me and the price is terrific. Got it off the Sample List.
 
Ubiquitous, you say???
I had to look that word up, Pappa. Bucky
 


Edited by cheaptrick - April/14/2008 at 14:59
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RifleDude Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/14/2008 at 15:44

For a general hunting & plinking .22, I prefer either a good fixed 4X or a low powered variable that is either parallax adjusted for 50 yards or has parallax adjustment that goes down to at least 50, if not 25 yds. 

Between a .22LR and a .17 (either HMR or HM2), I would go for the .17 as well.  The .17s give you basically twice the effective range, and they are usually more accurate due to the jacketed, more streamlined V-Max style bullets and special powders used.  A 1.5-6X, 2-7X, 3-9X scope works well for it, and a standard centerfire scope is fine because of the increased practical range of the .17s.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Legs in the Air Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/14/2008 at 15:53
You might want to stay away from the Nikon. I understand that its minimum focus rage is somewhere around 50 yds so anything closer than that will be blurry.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RifleDude Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/14/2008 at 16:00
Originally posted by PappaBear PappaBear wrote:

  I have mostly Conquest scopes, but really like the Nikon's for the money.  Any suggestions are apprecaited. 

 

 
Since you are a Conquest fan, have you seen the 50-yard parallax model fixed 4X Conquest?  It's a fantastic little rimfire scope!
 
Although it doesn't say on this page, this is the 50-yd parallax model of the 4X Conquest:
 
I haven't played with the Sako Quad, but I know the new Weatherby MK XXII uses an Anschutz barreled action, so it will undoubtedly shoot!  If you are considering a rifle in that price range, I would also encourage you to take a hard look at the Cooper M57, which is just as accurate, and is available in .22LR, .17HMR, and .17HM2... and, it looks as well as it shoots.  Speaking of Anschutz, I would also consider one of their rimfires as well; they're consistently one of the most accurate you can buy.  If you can find one, you might also look at the now-discontinued Kimber .22s.  There are still some available for sale, and they are nice, high-end rifles at a price point just below Cooper and Anschutz.  If you're interested in something unique, a departure from a traditional bolt action, the new Browning T-Bolt is a nice little rimfire as well, and it seems to have a reputation for being quite accurate. 


Edited by RifleDude - April/14/2008 at 16:03
Ted


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cheaptrick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/14/2008 at 16:03
Originally posted by Legs in the Air Legs in the Air wrote:

You might want to stay away from the Nikon. I understand that its minimum focus rage is somewhere around 50 yds so anything closer than that will be blurry.
 
Somebody please correct me If I'm wrong about this..
 
Good point.
 
The 4-12x Monarch has an AO, but I can't remember how close it will focus.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ed Connelly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/14/2008 at 16:12
Holy Jumpin' Jehosophat!! Is Kimber discontinuing their 22??  IS THIS THE END OF CIVILIZATION??!! 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RifleDude Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/14/2008 at 16:54
Originally posted by Ed Connelly Ed Connelly wrote:

Holy Jumpin' Jehosophat!! Is Kimber discontinuing their 22??  IS THIS THE END OF CIVILIZATION??!! 
 
They already did... again! 
I wonder if now the Kimber of America .22 will become as sought after by collectors as the previous Kimber of Oregon M82?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tahqua Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/14/2008 at 17:42
I am surprised you mention the 17HMR in the same context as the .22 LR. The .17 exceeds the LR in power and trajectory in every respect.
The .22 WMR is an excellent performer that is closer  to the .17. It doesn't shoot as flat but is better in the wind and penetrates better.
Here's my Ruger 77 in .22 WMR with a Leupold 3.5-10x50 AO. It is a bit better for the bigger stuff like coyote and fox than the .17 HMR. If you are only considering squirrels it is just another option. This scope has proven perfect for this guns purpose. It is used on close range vermin and doggies after dark.








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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PappaBear Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/14/2008 at 22:38
Cheapt, RifleD & Tahqua,
 
Thanks for good responses.  Tahqua, I like that rifle you got there.  And for the Kimber idea-huh-I saw one in Cabellas on sale.  RifleD, I'd like to check out some of those unique rifles you mention.  Problem is finding them.  Only so many crazy people out there ready to shell for a .22.  I had a guy tell me was crazy for the .22 Mag.  Made me think.
 
I know I can find Kimber and Weatherby, if you had to pick, what would you go with?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rkingston Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/15/2008 at 11:57
I second the .22 WMR. Its a good round and the ammo costs around half as much as the same box of .17. Its also a true jacketed (not gilded) round and can now be easily found in the popular ballistic tip version. I went with a Bushnell 4200 4-16X40mm on mine and its great. Some will say its too much scope but I don't think so. 10 yards to 100 its hard to beat.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TheGlockman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/15/2008 at 15:54
Estimated friends:

I have a CZ 452 2E ZKM Varmint rifle in .17HMR caliber, with a  Bushenll Elite 4200 6x24x50 mil dot reticle rifle scope.   This is wonderful and very accurate  with 150metres 1" groups. Sometimes when the wind blows, I make corrections with the mil dots. I think this is a very good equipment.

Regards for you all.    
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote koshkin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/15/2008 at 16:49
Personally, I like 22WMR the most of the rimfires that I have tried, but I know of quite a few people who swear by 17HMR. 

As for scopes, I think 3-9x scope with AO is probably the best choice.  There are several of them around.  I like Sightron S2 Big Sky 3-9x36AO quite a bit, personally.  If you want a higher end scope, any Kahles CL with side focus knob would do fine.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 3_tens Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/16/2008 at 00:20
They both have here place. .22wmr does have more thump but the accuracy of the .17 out to 150 yds is better than anything I have ever shot. The .17 is also better in wind out to 150 yds. because of its speed. Rats at the dump hate the HMR.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jonbravado Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/16/2008 at 07:51
i would have to strongly vote for 22LR - millions of different cartridges to choose from (and actually affordable ammo) and really fun out of an accurate bolt gun.
 
i just bought my 3rd 22LR last year - it was a CZ 452 varmint - really nice gun - great wood and action and drives tacks.  The trigger wasn't terrible, but i went ahead and got a riflebasix trigger kit and installed it myself (about 14oz w/ a clean break). I put a nikon prostaff on it (fixed 4 power) and couldn't be much happier. it's a pleasure to shoot paper or varmints. all in all - i have under 600 in this setup.  my 2 cents.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ed Connelly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/16/2008 at 20:05
You cannot own too many 22s.  It's impossible. Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RifleDude Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/17/2008 at 07:06
Originally posted by Ed Connelly Ed Connelly wrote:

You cannot own too many 22s.  It's impossible. Smile
 
That has been proven by numerous scientific studies!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RifleDude Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/17/2008 at 07:14
Originally posted by PappaBear PappaBear wrote:

I know I can find Kimber and Weatherby, if you had to pick, what would you go with?
 
You can't go wrong with either.  Between those two, I would bet the Weatherby, with its Anschutz iron, will likely outshoot the Kimber, but I like the action, overall appearance, and the style of the Kimber better (I prefer Classic style stocks with satin finishes over glossy finished Monte Carlo stocks personally).  In that class of rimfire, I would get a Cooper M57-M, though.  I think it is perhaps the best rimfire you can buy, and it will shoot with the Anschutz.  If you shop around on the internet auction sites like gunsamerica.com and gunbroker.com, you shouldn't have any trouble finding one.  One of our members here, Roy Finn has a gorgeous example of a Cooper 57M Custom Classic.  You should see it! 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mike650 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/17/2008 at 10:52
How does the Ruger 10/22 rate amongst all of these other fine rifle suggestions? Mine seems to be a nice little shooter for rabbits but just curious since it hasn't been mentioned. 

Edited by mike650 - April/17/2008 at 10:53
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tahqua Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/17/2008 at 11:20
I have two of them. Mine are standard models and over twenty years old. They both shoot around an inch at fifty yards. I like them for their compactness. I also like the fact that they function with the sub-sonic rounds. That is a real bonus when plugging the pests at night.
They aren't like the better bolt guns but I think they hold their own against most .22's. They have become a classic rimfire gun IMO.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tahqua Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/17/2008 at 11:54
Originally posted by RifleDude RifleDude wrote:

Originally posted by Ed Connelly Ed Connelly wrote:

You cannot own too many 22s.  It's impossible. Smile
 
That has been proven by numerous scientific studies!


My ongoing study. As you can see I need to gather more information on rifles. The Cooper sounds about right. Though, I have been looking for a 541T.
Sorry, all I have is my phone cam right now.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/17/2008 at 12:10
I might as well throw out my suggestion  ---   buy one of each. A guy really needs at least one 22 rifle as a survival gun ammo is relatively inexpensive and if you put $200. into 22 ammo you have a hell of a lot of ammo (about 550 for $12.ea)  enough that if they stopped making or selling ammo you would not be impacted for a very long time and could continue to eat rabbits or squirrels or whatever happened by if society broke down and the grocery didn't open tomorrow. Now that same $200 will buy you about 15 boxes of 50 rounds each when it comes to 22 mag or 17HMR.  Dont know about you but I can shoot a couple of hundred rounds of rimfire in an afternoon so I think a 22 is a must.  I would put a 3-9 x40 on it and sightron makes a S1 mil dot that is nice and the dots make good hold over. Sight in at 50 yds and the first dot down is about 100 yds on 9x.  I like the ruger 10-22 because you can get high capacity mags and the system and folding stocks or you can get heavy barrel accurate set ups.  I recently bought a bolt action stainless Marlin 22 and was rather disappointed to find groups about baseball size at 100. I have had a blue Marlin that was much more accurate so not sure whats going on there.  I do like the Savage accutrigger guns and the CZ is Kimber quality for half the price.   I like the 22 mag and the 17 is reported to be ultra accurate but it sure isnt a very heavy bullet.  I knew a special forces guy who used a 22 mag bolt gun in Vietnam behind enemy lines with very good success in the 100 to 150 yd range.  It would be nice to have one of each but the 22 is a must have.  From there it depends on what you are shooting at. One of my friends has a 17 that he loves for shooting crows. With a 17 I think the 4-16x40 Bushnell 4200 would be a good scope.  The Super Sniper in a 16x or 20x might be a good choice also. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mike650 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/17/2008 at 12:37
Originally posted by tahqua tahqua wrote:

Originally posted by RifleDude RifleDude wrote:

Originally posted by Ed Connelly Ed Connelly wrote:

You cannot own too many 22s.  It's impossible. Smile
 
That has been proven by numerous scientific studies!


My ongoing study. As you can see I need to gather more information on rifles. The Cooper sounds about right. Though, I have been looking for a 541T.
Sorry, all I have is my phone cam right now.






Oh man, that's quite a selection. Big%20Smile

Just looked at the original post again, he was asking about bolt actions, me bad.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RifleDude Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/17/2008 at 12:38
Originally posted by mike650 mike650 wrote:

How does the Ruger 10/22 rate amongst all of these other fine rifle suggestions? Mine seems to be a nice little shooter for rabbits but just curious since it hasn't been mentioned. 
 
Though you can make autoloaders very accurate, and there are tons of aftermarket parts for the 10/22 platform, including match barrels and trigger assemblies, an auto at best may equal the accuracy of a well-tuned bolt gun, but usually won't quite match the best bolt gun accuracy.  The reason is simple.  A bolt gun has a fixed breech, tight lockup, and there are fewer moving parts in the fire control system to transmit vibrations.  An auto on the other hand, uses some of the energy from firing to cycle the action.  This introduces inconsistent variables like extra vibrations that are transmitted to the barrel during firing.  In addition, the chamber of all autos has to be more "open" toleranced in order to ensure reliable feeding, as opposed to the bolt gun, which can have tighter chambers because of the extra camming power of the bolt.  These are the reasons why semi-autos are more prone to throwing fliers outside of groups.
 
This doesn't mean that an autoloader can't be extremely accurate, only that the finest autos usually don't quite meet the accuracy levels of the finest bolt actions.


Edited by RifleDude - April/17/2008 at 12:39
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