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sombody explain red dots/ prism

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porkchop401 View Drop Down
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    Posted: December/16/2018 at 09:08
  Howdy fellas ,  I have  a H&R handi rifle in 444 marlin that I use for the primitive season here in Louisiana. I am in the thickets with this gun and an average shot is 25-50 yds. with one breaking 100yds being kind of rare. I an looking at dots and prism sights for several reasons. 
1. getting the scope away from my head
2. wanting the fastest handling scope / rifle combo I can get 
3. something less bulky  than the 3-9x50 that came on it.
4. a optic that is mounted  ahead of the hammer for ease of cocking
 Questions 
1. how much do I have to spend to get reliability in therms of holding zero and electronics? (recoil)
2. how well do the things perform in almost no light (dusk and dawn ) I realize you can see the dot  but what about image quality.
 3. with say a 2moa dot what is max effective range (I know it varies with the shooter} 
4. what is typical battery life and do any have auto shut off  after a period to conserve batteries.

I m a public land hunter and tend to migrate with different seasons on our WMA's so I end up with several weeks a year to climb trees and look down in thickets.  I am concerned about needing this thing and it not working!
Sincerely PC401
The unprepared are the most likely to suffer;    Teddy R.
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koshkin View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote koshkin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/16/2018 at 15:11
First of all, red dot sights and prism scopes are entirely different animals and should be considered separately.

Virtually all prism scopes are designed to be mounted on ARs, so they will not work well at all on the Handi-Rifle simply from a mounting standpoint.

Red dot sights come in a variety of mounts, but there are plenty of red dot sights that will work perfectly fine on the HandiRifle.

In the past, you had to spend quite a lot of money to get a reliable red dot, but nowadays quite a few moderately priced red dot sights seem to do well.  One moderately priced sight I like is HiLux MM2.  I've had one for a while and it is holding up quite well.

It looks like SWFA has it on sale right now:  
https://www.swfa.com/leatherwood-1x20-mm-2-digital-red-dot-sight.html, but you would need to add a low mount to it.

There are other of course.  For example, several Holosun offerings will work well for you.

Now, that having been said, in terms of low light performance, red dot sights do not let you see the target any better.  They do let you see the aiming point really well in all lighting conditions, so they are very good for speed.  If you want to get a little help from the optic in low light, you should consider some sort of a low power magnified optic with eye relief long enough to clear the hammer.

The simplest choice is probably something like the Leupold FX-2.5 ultralight which is a fixed power 2.5x20 scope.  It used to be available with a thick duplex that was excellent in low light, but some inconceivable reason, I only see it with a wide duplex right now.

Another good option is NikonMonarch 3 1-4x20:

and Leupold VX-3i 1.5-5x20:

Both of these have #4 reticle that are very good in low light.  In terms of seeing your target, both of these scopes will help you a lot more than a red dot sight will.

If you are willing to go up in price a bit, this will walk all over everything else I mentioned so far in terms of low light performance, but it is probably an overkill for your rifle and applications:

ILya



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porkchop401 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote porkchop401 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/17/2018 at 14:19
 Thanks for the great information, Will I be able to see as good with a quality red dot as with the naked eye in low light. I have quality conventional scopes that I find my self looking through constantly the last few minutes of light when hunting on sendero's from box stands where I am focused on a feeder. The hunting I am now doing is like bow hunting from climbing tree stands  except with a short range rifle that meets the specifications as per hunting regulations if I can see the deer he is on top of me and often moving fairly fast at times. This past week I had run-ins with 3 fairly large bucks  all of which was hot on the trail of does in tight woods . Of the 3 I  could have shot 1 but passed due to his rack being trashed from fighting. If I had more confidence in a shot gun I would be using one with a bead sight. Low light performance is a small part of the pie in the scheme of things. friends think I am nuts for considering putting a $500 red dot on a 200 rifle. 
The unprepared are the most likely to suffer;    Teddy R.
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supertool73 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote supertool73 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/17/2018 at 17:43
In my experience because of the slight tint of a red dot, they are not that great in low light.  Magnification helps you see better in low light as well. 
Lifetime warranty and excellent customer service don't mean a thing when your gun fails during a zombie attack.

"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything they don't own."
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porkchop401 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote porkchop401 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/17/2018 at 18:51
In a 9hr day hunting only about 30 min require low light performance . Not getting pegged buy buy this hammer and quick target acquisition are primarily my goals does anyone make a scope with 5" of eye relief?
The unprepared are the most likely to suffer;    Teddy R.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scrumbag Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/18/2018 at 02:09
Leupold 1.5-5x33 Scout Scope. Red dot on 1.5 is quick and can be mounted in front of the hammer
Was sure I had a point when I started this post...
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supertool73 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote supertool73 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/18/2018 at 09:09
What about using a Trijicon Accupoint 1-4x with a green triangle.  I have that and on 1x the FOV is huge, the triangle aiming point is red dot fast and you can find it and see it in any light condition.  It is my favorite scope of all the scopes I own.  The glass is excellent and the illumination system always works and will never run dead during a hunt with bad batteries.  They are pricey, but they are excellent. 

I ran mine on my 45-70 marlin for a while, but it now runs on my SBR that I use as my primary AR.  It is just a great all around scope IMO. 
Lifetime warranty and excellent customer service don't mean a thing when your gun fails during a zombie attack.

"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything they don't own."
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